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	<title>Comments on: Sedition</title>
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		<title>By: podrock</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48058</link>
		<dc:creator>podrock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Jan 2022 05:34:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48058</guid>
		<description>Came across this the other day. I&#039;m not a big fan of these sorts of studies yet this one rang my cognitive bias, so what the hell. 

&lt;blockquote&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Some people just want to watch the world burn: the prevalence, psychology and politics of the ‘Need for Chaos’&lt;/strong&gt;
&lt;em&gt;Kevin Arceneaux, Timothy B. Gravelle, Mathias Osmundsen, Michael Bang Petersen, Jason Reifler and Thomas J. Scotto&lt;/em&gt;
Published:22 February 2021https://doi.org/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147

Abstract
People form political attitudes to serve psychological needs. Recent research shows that some individuals have a strong desire to incite chaos when they perceive themselves to be marginalized by society. These individuals tend to see chaos as a way to invert the power structure and gain social status in the process. Analysing data drawn from large-scale representative surveys conducted in Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States, we identify the prevalence of Need for Chaos across Anglo-Saxon societies. Using Latent Profile Analysis, we explore whether different subtypes underlie the uni-dimensional construct and find evidence that some people may be motivated to seek out chaos because they want to rebuild society, while others enjoy destruction for its own sake. We demonstrate that chaos-seekers are not a unified political group but a divergent set of malcontents. Multiple pathways can lead individuals to ‘want to watch the world burn’.

This article is part of the theme issue ‘The political brain: neurocognitive and computational mechanisms’.

&lt;a href=&quot;https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147
&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Came across this the other day. I&#8217;m not a big fan of these sorts of studies yet this one rang my cognitive bias, so what the hell. </p>
<blockquote><p>
<strong>Some people just want to watch the world burn: the prevalence, psychology and politics of the ‘Need for Chaos’</strong><br />
<em>Kevin Arceneaux, Timothy B. Gravelle, Mathias Osmundsen, Michael Bang Petersen, Jason Reifler and Thomas J. Scotto</em><br />
Published:22 February 2021https://doi.org/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147</p>
<p>Abstract<br />
People form political attitudes to serve psychological needs. Recent research shows that some individuals have a strong desire to incite chaos when they perceive themselves to be marginalized by society. These individuals tend to see chaos as a way to invert the power structure and gain social status in the process. Analysing data drawn from large-scale representative surveys conducted in Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States, we identify the prevalence of Need for Chaos across Anglo-Saxon societies. Using Latent Profile Analysis, we explore whether different subtypes underlie the uni-dimensional construct and find evidence that some people may be motivated to seek out chaos because they want to rebuild society, while others enjoy destruction for its own sake. We demonstrate that chaos-seekers are not a unified political group but a divergent set of malcontents. Multiple pathways can lead individuals to ‘want to watch the world burn’.</p>
<p>This article is part of the theme issue ‘The political brain: neurocognitive and computational mechanisms’.</p>
<p><a href="https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147" rel="nofollow"></a><a href="https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147" rel="nofollow">https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2020.0147</a></p>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48053</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2022 21:47:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48053</guid>
		<description>but I must admit I&#039;ve been mentally visiting many of the same scenarios you have, and for many of the same reasons.

Its impossible to predict the future, but it is possible to make informed estimates and educated projections.
I&#039;m afraid I agree with you, only perhaps with less certainty, and perhaps not so quickly.  Or as we sometimes say in the stilted jargon of science, &quot;we agree in kind, if not in degree&quot;.

I would like to think we can blame this all on Trump, or the Republicans, or the Chinese or the Russians, or the panicky middle classes of America and Western Europe, but I suspect those may not be the causes of the coming emergency, but just the symptoms.  The driver behind the coming catastrophe is indeed the climate crisis.


If I were forced to make an actual prediction, I would guess the historical precedent I am most reminded of is the global situation on or about the late 1930s.  The only bright spot I can bring up is that if I had been around at that time and place, I would never had anticipated the Axis powers would lose.

So maybe we still have hope.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>but I must admit I&#8217;ve been mentally visiting many of the same scenarios you have, and for many of the same reasons.</p>
<p>Its impossible to predict the future, but it is possible to make informed estimates and educated projections.<br />
I&#8217;m afraid I agree with you, only perhaps with less certainty, and perhaps not so quickly.  Or as we sometimes say in the stilted jargon of science, &#8220;we agree in kind, if not in degree&#8221;.</p>
<p>I would like to think we can blame this all on Trump, or the Republicans, or the Chinese or the Russians, or the panicky middle classes of America and Western Europe, but I suspect those may not be the causes of the coming emergency, but just the symptoms.  The driver behind the coming catastrophe is indeed the climate crisis.</p>
<p>If I were forced to make an actual prediction, I would guess the historical precedent I am most reminded of is the global situation on or about the late 1930s.  The only bright spot I can bring up is that if I had been around at that time and place, I would never had anticipated the Axis powers would lose.</p>
<p>So maybe we still have hope.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48052</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2022 20:41:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48052</guid>
		<description>But the horrific situation is not just here in the US.
Fascism is advancing in great strides all over the world... 15 years ago I would have said the US would be one of the nations to be most resistant to the trend, now I watch in horror as we lead the march towards authoritarianism and fascism.

American democracy will end- permanently- within the next 4 years, in many ways its already dead, but the plug will be pulled on its life support before the end of 2024. I do not feel I am being alarmist in saying this, I simply think its a fact. As much as it pains me to say it, I simply do not see a way to avoid it- I know this sounds like fatalism- which I have always considered the lazy or cowardly man&#039;s excuse for inaction. But I simply see no viable course of action given the current state of affairs. 

It&#039;s not just America, governments the world over are teetering on the edge, with far right parties gaining traction everywhere. If I had the freedom to pick up and move to the &#039;safest&#039; country, I would pick New Zealand. Nearly all of Europe, America, Australia are all clearly heading down a very dark path, with increasing speed.

I have long seen a global decline into fascism as inevitable, I just didn&#039;t expect it so soon. 15 years ago I thought it likely that it would happen after my lifetime- but with each passing year the likely date has moved many years closer. I had expected the collapse into fascism would be in response to the massive refugee crisis that WILL come as a result of climate change, (Yes, we are seeing a refugee crisis now, but what is to come will be MANY orders of magnitude worse) but the world seems to be preemptively heading to that destination BEFORE that crisis hits in full force. Whether its by design or by a random confluence of factors the world will be in the grip of fascism BEFORE the climate crisis truly hits in force. This will, of course, make everything worse- as governments turn inwards in an effort to control their increasingly panicked and insecure populaces there will be no possibility for the united and global actions needed to address the existential crisis- the crisis will only accelerate. 

At some point- very likely in my lifetime, unless I am caught up in one of the first waves of carnage- global civilization will collapse. I suspect the deaths from the coming turmoil will be in the billions by 2050.

Feel free to tell me I am alarmist, or crazy- I genuinely hope you are right- If our democracy is stronger in 2025 than it is today in contrast to my expectations you have my permission to ridicule me mercilessly, and I will be happy to be the butt of the jokes.

But I don&#039;t think I am wrong, and I suspect most of you, the ones capable of thinking about such things objectively - on some level- feel the same certain dread as I do.

For once, screaming &#039;THE END IS NEAR!&#039; doesn&#039;t seem so crazy... does it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But the horrific situation is not just here in the US.<br />
Fascism is advancing in great strides all over the world&#8230; 15 years ago I would have said the US would be one of the nations to be most resistant to the trend, now I watch in horror as we lead the march towards authoritarianism and fascism.</p>
<p>American democracy will end- permanently- within the next 4 years, in many ways its already dead, but the plug will be pulled on its life support before the end of 2024. I do not feel I am being alarmist in saying this, I simply think its a fact. As much as it pains me to say it, I simply do not see a way to avoid it- I know this sounds like fatalism- which I have always considered the lazy or cowardly man&#8217;s excuse for inaction. But I simply see no viable course of action given the current state of affairs. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s not just America, governments the world over are teetering on the edge, with far right parties gaining traction everywhere. If I had the freedom to pick up and move to the &#8216;safest&#8217; country, I would pick New Zealand. Nearly all of Europe, America, Australia are all clearly heading down a very dark path, with increasing speed.</p>
<p>I have long seen a global decline into fascism as inevitable, I just didn&#8217;t expect it so soon. 15 years ago I thought it likely that it would happen after my lifetime- but with each passing year the likely date has moved many years closer. I had expected the collapse into fascism would be in response to the massive refugee crisis that WILL come as a result of climate change, (Yes, we are seeing a refugee crisis now, but what is to come will be MANY orders of magnitude worse) but the world seems to be preemptively heading to that destination BEFORE that crisis hits in full force. Whether its by design or by a random confluence of factors the world will be in the grip of fascism BEFORE the climate crisis truly hits in force. This will, of course, make everything worse- as governments turn inwards in an effort to control their increasingly panicked and insecure populaces there will be no possibility for the united and global actions needed to address the existential crisis- the crisis will only accelerate. </p>
<p>At some point- very likely in my lifetime, unless I am caught up in one of the first waves of carnage- global civilization will collapse. I suspect the deaths from the coming turmoil will be in the billions by 2050.</p>
<p>Feel free to tell me I am alarmist, or crazy- I genuinely hope you are right- If our democracy is stronger in 2025 than it is today in contrast to my expectations you have my permission to ridicule me mercilessly, and I will be happy to be the butt of the jokes.</p>
<p>But I don&#8217;t think I am wrong, and I suspect most of you, the ones capable of thinking about such things objectively &#8211; on some level- feel the same certain dread as I do.</p>
<p>For once, screaming &#8216;THE END IS NEAR!&#8217; doesn&#8217;t seem so crazy&#8230; does it?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48050</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2022 19:05:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48050</guid>
		<description>I think the world has a pretty good grasp of what is happening here

Cartoon from Norway a few years back:
&lt;img src=&quot;https://www.habitablezone.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Trump-toddler.jpg&quot; alt=&quot;&quot; width=&quot;800&quot; /&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the world has a pretty good grasp of what is happening here</p>
<p>Cartoon from Norway a few years back:<br />
<img src="https://www.habitablezone.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Trump-toddler.jpg" alt="" width="800" /></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48045</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2022 05:28:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48045</guid>
		<description>No matter how this works out, the world needs to watch, very closely.
This will either be a great tragedy, or an enormous triumph.  We are watching play out one of the great moments of history, like the French Revolution, or the Russian Revolution.  Whatever happens will change the world forever.  I used to fantasize about living in times like this, to be an eyewitness to history; but now that I am here I feel nothing but dread.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No matter how this works out, the world needs to watch, very closely.<br />
This will either be a great tragedy, or an enormous triumph.  We are watching play out one of the great moments of history, like the French Revolution, or the Russian Revolution.  Whatever happens will change the world forever.  I used to fantasize about living in times like this, to be an eyewitness to history; but now that I am here I feel nothing but dread.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Kirikiri</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48038</link>
		<dc:creator>Kirikiri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2022 04:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48038</guid>
		<description>Horrific situation over there </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Horrific situation over there</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48031</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2022 06:42:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48031</guid>
		<description>They will have free reign...
These nitwits, bigots, and violent fascists will define our nation for the foreseeable future.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They will have free reign&#8230;<br />
These nitwits, bigots, and violent fascists will define our nation for the foreseeable future.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48029</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2022 01:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48029</guid>
		<description>



&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https://www.huffpost.com/entry/brit-hume-jan-6-insurrection_n_61e0b00ee4b022634fa6d765&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Fox News senior political analyst Brit Hume got a Twitter dragging Wednesday over a tweet that aged poorly almost immediately&lt;/a&gt;.

“Here’s a thought. Let’s base our view on whether 1/6 was an ‘insurrection’ on whether those arrested are charged with insurrection. So far, none has been,” the conservative commentator wrote, sharing a link to a Wall Street Journal opinion post that he apparently disagreed with about calling the Jan. 6 Capitol attack “what it was: a violent insurrection.”
Within a few hours of Hume’s post, news broke that 11 members of the right-wing Oath Keepers, including founder Stewart Rhodes, had been arrested and charged with seditious conspiracy in connection to the attack on the Capitol. It’s the most serious charge yet in the sprawling investigation, which has seen more than 700 people charged.

Both seditious conspiracy and insurrection against the government are serious federal crimes, though seditious conspiracy actually holds more severe penalties than insurrection — up to 20 years imprisonment. Charges of insurrection or incitement of insurrection involve fines and imprisonment of up to 10 years.

Hume later shared a link to the Oath Keepers news but did not directly address whether it had altered his thinking about how to define the Jan. 6, 2021 attack.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><a href="https://www.huffpost.com/entry/brit-hume-jan-6-insurrection_n_61e0b00ee4b022634fa6d765" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Fox News senior political analyst Brit Hume got a Twitter dragging Wednesday over a tweet that aged poorly almost immediately</a>.</p>
<p>“Here’s a thought. Let’s base our view on whether 1/6 was an ‘insurrection’ on whether those arrested are charged with insurrection. So far, none has been,” the conservative commentator wrote, sharing a link to a Wall Street Journal opinion post that he apparently disagreed with about calling the Jan. 6 Capitol attack “what it was: a violent insurrection.”<br />
Within a few hours of Hume’s post, news broke that 11 members of the right-wing Oath Keepers, including founder Stewart Rhodes, had been arrested and charged with seditious conspiracy in connection to the attack on the Capitol. It’s the most serious charge yet in the sprawling investigation, which has seen more than 700 people charged.</p>
<p>Both seditious conspiracy and insurrection against the government are serious federal crimes, though seditious conspiracy actually holds more severe penalties than insurrection — up to 20 years imprisonment. Charges of insurrection or incitement of insurrection involve fines and imprisonment of up to 10 years.</p>
<p>Hume later shared a link to the Oath Keepers news but did not directly address whether it had altered his thinking about how to define the Jan. 6, 2021 attack.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: podrock</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2022/01/13/sedition/#comment-48028</link>
		<dc:creator>podrock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jan 2022 22:31:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=90744#comment-48028</guid>
		<description>And wow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And wow.</p>
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