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	<title>Comments on: Right-wing ideology growing poverty, welfare state</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/</link>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22858</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 17:45:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22858</guid>
		<description>Who gets to decide what&#039;s &quot;fair?&quot;

How do they decide?

What will they do about it?

Do you really want to turn over that much power to someone?  Anyone?

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2007/oct07/10-18GlobalIDCStudyPR.aspx&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Microsoft economic impact&lt;/a&gt;

Look at your terminology.  &quot;Harvested?&quot; I paid freely and voluntarily for my Microsoft products, and was given a choice between them and others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who gets to decide what&#8217;s &#8220;fair?&#8221;</p>
<p>How do they decide?</p>
<p>What will they do about it?</p>
<p>Do you really want to turn over that much power to someone?  Anyone?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2007/oct07/10-18GlobalIDCStudyPR.aspx" rel="nofollow">Microsoft economic impact</a></p>
<p>Look at your terminology.  &#8220;Harvested?&#8221; I paid freely and voluntarily for my Microsoft products, and was given a choice between them and others.</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22857</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 17:27:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22857</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;You illustrated my point for me.&lt;/p&gt;

A mule driver got about $15 a week in the late 1880s, which is about $340 a week in today&#039;s dollars, or $17,680 a year.

A hundred times that amount is about $1.8 million.  You think it&#039;s a social injustice that a truck driver doesn&#039;t make that every year?

Do any of you people know what the term &quot;productivity&quot; actually means?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You illustrated my point for me.</p>
<p>A mule driver got about $15 a week in the late 1880s, which is about $340 a week in today&#8217;s dollars, or $17,680 a year.</p>
<p>A hundred times that amount is about $1.8 million.  You think it&#8217;s a social injustice that a truck driver doesn&#8217;t make that every year?</p>
<p>Do any of you people know what the term &#8220;productivity&#8221; actually means?</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22856</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 16:02:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22856</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure about the &quot;fairness&quot; of companies with profit margins like Microsoft had.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure about the &#8220;fairness&#8221; of companies with profit margins like Microsoft had.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22854</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 05:59:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22854</guid>
		<description>Your point is that truck drivers should starve because the results of productivity should go to higher management and to a lesser extent shareholders.  Do you realize how simple that is?  That it only gets complex when one tries to deny it?  That it is the Conservative agenda to have a few superwealthy, a middle class which services them (physicians, engineers, etc.), and the rest poor, cheap and available?

It takes a person capable of seeing the results of their policies to be able to honestly answer that.  The rest weasel.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your point is that truck drivers should starve because the results of productivity should go to higher management and to a lesser extent shareholders.  Do you realize how simple that is?  That it only gets complex when one tries to deny it?  That it is the Conservative agenda to have a few superwealthy, a middle class which services them (physicians, engineers, etc.), and the rest poor, cheap and available?</p>
<p>It takes a person capable of seeing the results of their policies to be able to honestly answer that.  The rest weasel.</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22853</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:40:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22853</guid>
		<description>Computer tech and its offshoots, to be precise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Computer tech and its offshoots, to be precise.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22852</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:32:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22852</guid>
		<description>Tech. n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tech. n/t</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22850</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 02:42:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22850</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Test question:&lt;/p&gt;

During the huge rise in productivity in the 1990s, what industries were driving it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Test question:</p>
<p>During the huge rise in productivity in the 1990s, what industries were driving it?</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22849</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 02:35:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22849</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Do you have any idea how complex the question is?&lt;/p&gt;

Can you think of any other reasons besides Evil Capitalism that productivity might begin to outrace wages after the 70s?

I&#039;m speaking as someone who was able to the amount of design, drafting, and engineering that took a dozen or more people and even multiple vendors to do during the Apollo program.  Do you have any idea how many jobs one full-up station of ProEngineer is capable of?

Oddly, I wasn&#039;t making a dozen times an Apollo engineer&#039;s salary at the time.

With a computer and three printers I handled presentation work on my own that used to take artists, photo typesetters, and print shops to deliver.

This is just a situation I&#039;m personally familiar with.  Multiply by hundreds of industries.

Odds are good this occurred to someone at EPI, but it wouldn&#039;t deliver the propaganda they needed, so it wasn&#039;t included in their paper.

Now, you can pretend not to understand what the hell I&#039;m talking about.  I&#039;m not sure why I&#039;m bothering to drag out another futile thread.

You didn&#039;t answer my question.  What do you propose to do about the &quot;injustice?&quot;  The centrally-planned nation EPI has pushed for years?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you have any idea how complex the question is?</p>
<p>Can you think of any other reasons besides Evil Capitalism that productivity might begin to outrace wages after the 70s?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m speaking as someone who was able to the amount of design, drafting, and engineering that took a dozen or more people and even multiple vendors to do during the Apollo program.  Do you have any idea how many jobs one full-up station of ProEngineer is capable of?</p>
<p>Oddly, I wasn&#8217;t making a dozen times an Apollo engineer&#8217;s salary at the time.</p>
<p>With a computer and three printers I handled presentation work on my own that used to take artists, photo typesetters, and print shops to deliver.</p>
<p>This is just a situation I&#8217;m personally familiar with.  Multiply by hundreds of industries.</p>
<p>Odds are good this occurred to someone at EPI, but it wouldn&#8217;t deliver the propaganda they needed, so it wasn&#8217;t included in their paper.</p>
<p>Now, you can pretend not to understand what the hell I&#8217;m talking about.  I&#8217;m not sure why I&#8217;m bothering to drag out another futile thread.</p>
<p>You didn&#8217;t answer my question.  What do you propose to do about the &#8220;injustice?&#8221;  The centrally-planned nation EPI has pushed for years?</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22848</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2013 01:50:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22848</guid>
		<description>Rob wrote about a multidecade trend. What&#039;s &quot;right now&quot; have to do with it?

In any case, you&#039;re wasting words nibbling around the edges of the issue. Do you acknowledge Rob&#039;s point about the imbalance in benefits from three decades of productivity growth? Has the phrase &quot;a rising tide lifts all boats&quot; become embarrassingly inconvenient these days? It ought to make you squirm, if you had any integrity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rob wrote about a multidecade trend. What&#8217;s &#8220;right now&#8221; have to do with it?</p>
<p>In any case, you&#8217;re wasting words nibbling around the edges of the issue. Do you acknowledge Rob&#8217;s point about the imbalance in benefits from three decades of productivity growth? Has the phrase &#8220;a rising tide lifts all boats&#8221; become embarrassingly inconvenient these days? It ought to make you squirm, if you had any integrity.</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://www.habitablezone.com/2013/02/03/right-wing-ideology-growing-poverty-welfare-state/#comment-22844</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2013 23:08:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=30142#comment-22844</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The point was that &quot;right wing ideology&quot; isn&#039;t exactly running the show right now.&lt;/p&gt;

So tell me how you&#039;re going to &quot;rectify&quot; this perceived injustice.

I already know the EPI solutions.  I&#039;ve read a lot more of their papers than just the one Rob quoted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The point was that &#8220;right wing ideology&#8221; isn&#8217;t exactly running the show right now.</p>
<p>So tell me how you&#8217;re going to &#8220;rectify&#8221; this perceived injustice.</p>
<p>I already know the EPI solutions.  I&#8217;ve read a lot more of their papers than just the one Rob quoted.</p>
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